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Freshness
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| mtuborg |
Posted on 07-07-2014 21:47
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Amateur
Posts: 22
Joined: 07-08-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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How do you keep freshness up?
I was riding Paris-Nice with my captain for San-remo, so that he would have a full week to recover for san-remo.
His freshness is still bad though. My riders from tirreno that had less time to recover, have full freshness though. Most of my other riders who rided paris nice also have excellent feshness.
It feels like its a lottery if your rider have good or bad freshness, if you a week after a race still have bad freshness.? |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 07-07-2014 21:48
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World Champion
Posts: 14744
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Nah. If they're not in peak form, the riders will have good and bad days, in terms of freshness. That's a new thing Cyanide introduced.
Edited by Jesleyh on 07-07-2014 21:52
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| Dee-Jay |
Posted on 10-07-2014 23:27
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Free Agent
Posts: 129
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PCM$: 200.00
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So is it the freshness value which leads to my guys starting races with reduced yellow and red bars, as if fatigued from early stages (but at the start of a stage race)?
Also do the Resistance and Fighter stats work, and what specifically do they do (sorry for changing the subject a bit). |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 13-12-2025 00:07
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| Lachi |
Posted on 10-07-2014 23:33
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8360
Joined: 29-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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There are at least 3 thread about freshness, use the forum search or have a look here. |
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| Conardo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 11:22
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Stagiare
Posts: 215
Joined: 20-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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Playing TdF as NetApp - simulating and 3D - after 3D my teams freshness is catastrophal.
When i simulate the tour complete, freshness is very well.
Why is that?
Edited by Conardo on 11-07-2014 11:22
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| mtuborg |
Posted on 20-07-2014 11:05
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Amateur
Posts: 22
Joined: 07-08-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Ok here is oe thing that really doesnt give any sence.
Im playing the tour de france, after stage 12, i have kept all my riders on excellent or very good(all have tour as objective). At the 12 th stage, im doing a mistake while im playing the stage, and stop one of my riders, i dont notice it before its to late tough.
So im looking if its worth to start onthe weekly sace instead, and lucky me, i would only have to ply 1 stage over again, so thought hat would be a nobrainer..
The thing is. Now my freshness on all my people are bad ore average, i only got 2 tiders that an crawl upto "good"
Really what the fuck is going on?
It actually started to like that freshness thing, cause i thought it made good sence(i just wished that i would also aply for CPU), so that the next best riders can beat the bestin minor races.
Is here eventually a way to edit this thing?
But serius if COMPLETELY random, even at your targets, then pull that thing out of the game we dont need any more random factors than the 700 crashes there already been mplented in 2014.
Edited by mtuborg on 20-07-2014 11:16
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| zachbastian |
Posted on 20-07-2014 11:09
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Free Agent
Posts: 125
Joined: 26-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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mtuborg wrote:
Ok here is oe thing that really doesnt give any sence.
Im playing the tour de france, after stage 12, i have kept all my riders on excellent or very good(all have tour as objective). At the 12 th stage, im doing a mistake while im playing the stage, and stop one of my riders, i dont notice it before its to late tough.
So im looking if its worth to start onthe weekly sace instead, and lucky me, i would only have to ply 1 stage over again, so thought hat would be a nobrainer..
The thing is. Now my freshness on all my people are bad ore average, i only got 2 tiders that an crawl upto "good"
Really what the fuck is going on?
It actually started to like that freshness thing, cause i thought it made good sence(i just wished that i would also aply for CPU), so that the next best riders can beat the bestin minor races.
But serius if COMPLETELY random, even at your targets, then pull that thing out of the game we dont need any more random factors than the 700 crashes there already been mplented in 2014.
I Agree. Don´t make new features if not working. Only makes the game worse, than it already is. |
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| Thatguyeveryonehates |
Posted on 20-07-2014 11:15
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Domestique
Posts: 447
Joined: 01-05-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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It's not random, it's the first thing that works that Cyanide made in a long time
To improve form before his targets the cyclist has to train very hard. So his freshness goes down. Cyanide explained this.
During their target races freshness is fine if you don't do something stupid like putting him on 99% effort maintain position all the time. That tires a lot.
You have to save energy like in real races.
Edited by Thatguyeveryonehates on 20-07-2014 11:16
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| Lachi |
Posted on 20-07-2014 11:15
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8360
Joined: 29-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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The random factor only happens at the start of the race, not in between.
Either it is a bug, which you should report or you messed something up. |
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| mtuborg |
Posted on 20-07-2014 11:26
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Amateur
Posts: 22
Joined: 07-08-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Thatguyeveryonehates wrote:
It's not random, it's the first thing that works that Cyanide made in a long time
To improve form before his targets the cyclist has to train very hard. So his freshness goes down. Cyanide explained this.
During their target races freshness is fine if you don't do something stupid like putting him on 99% effort maintain position all the time. That tires a lot.
You have to save energy like in real races.
Try read what i wrote one more time.
Lachis yeah i havent tried this happen before i must admit, but again i dont really normally uses weekly saves, in the "normal" game there wasnt any problem, its only when i take that weekly save the day before. I wonder if it may not have used the resting day in the weekly save, since that was the day before.
Is here any way to edit the freshness via your editor, so i can get i were it belong
Edit: If anyone interested, you can see the diferenece in the game via these to savegames, there is only one day between.
https://gupl.dk/71... - Wekly save, bugged?
https://gupl.dk/71... -. normal save
Edited by mtuborg on 20-07-2014 11:30
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| Lachi |
Posted on 20-07-2014 12:30
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8360
Joined: 29-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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I think that the way the fitness is stored in the database did not change from PCM2013 but I also think that nobody tried to analyse how it works. Try the forum search in this and the official forum.
And I recommend that you send both saves to Cyanide or report in their forum. |
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| martyr1777 |
Posted on 24-07-2014 00:57
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Amateur
Posts: 15
Joined: 17-05-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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There is definately a game breaking bug with freshness. and based on my experience and this one it might be some odd kind of save corruption related to it.
I started a custom team did the aussie NC with 1 rider. move on to san luis and 5 of my 6 riders have bad freshness. All they did a was a preseason training camp the week before the race. I've done that on other teams and everyone still had perfect freshness, and the 6th rider had perfect freshness.
Seems to be rare thankfully but it's obviously VERY game breaking because your team is useless if it gets hit by this. |
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| Lachi |
Posted on 24-07-2014 01:14
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8360
Joined: 29-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Did you read the other posts, where we explained how it works?
In short: If a rider prepares for a season goal, he might train very hard which leads to reduced freshness in the weeks before his goal. |
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| martyr1777 |
Posted on 25-07-2014 18:36
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Amateur
Posts: 15
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Lachi wrote:
Did you read the other posts, where we explained how it works?
In short: If a rider prepares for a season goal, he might train very hard which leads to reduced freshness in the weeks before his goal.
It doesn't take a genius to know how something as simple as Freshness works.
Before I get into new details let me ask you this, does it make sense to train so hard for an objective that the rider is completely useless in the race itself?
Now that aside, if the first example I mentioned 4 riders all had "Bad" freshness before the start of San Luis, not all of them (if any) even had any objectives even in February so they couldn't have been over training.
But since that I tried yet again to salvage this train wreck of a game. Made another custom team and this time I watched the freshness levels. They all start excellent and stayed there. I did my preseason camp after the Aussie NC and everyone was fine. I had a rider in the NC and after he still had excellent freshness. Training camp starts and finishes, after that it goes all over the place. I first see all excellent, progress one more day and boom 4 riders have "Bad" freshness. Progress a couple days with no change then it all breaks loose and fluctuates wildly, Riders going from "Excellent" to "Bad", from "Bad" To "Very Good" etc. these are changes that should be happening over a weeks time, not in a single day.
The Freshness code is broken, no idea what's breaking it but it's quite broken, maybe it's the training camp, maybe it's new since the last patch. I don't know. Maybe it's as intended and Cyanide has no clue how to do it right. I don't know I just know it's wrong and makes the game unplayable. I can't get in any race other then the Aussie NC now with riders that have a chance of winning because of poor freshness.
BTW, I'm not just blowing smoke either, I've worked in the software development life cycle. But more so I'm a very experienced Football Manager player and FM has about 1000x the depth of PCM and they're fitness and condition code works. So it's not a matter of me not understanding the implementation.
Edit: Oh, and if the freshness was dropping because of training they why doesn't the fitness increase? Only time I've seen fitness change has been training camp and after races.
Edited by martyr1777 on 25-07-2014 18:44
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| Lachi |
Posted on 25-07-2014 19:16
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8360
Joined: 29-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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I told you how it should work. If this is not what you experienced, you could report it as bug.
BTW: No need to comment on your experience, I cannot verify it anyway. |
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| d-s |
Posted on 03-08-2014 13:15
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Amateur
Posts: 1
Joined: 17-08-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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I also find freshness broken.
Just starting Paris - Nice. It's a sponsor goal, it's a goal for several riders. These riders had the same schedule towards Paris-Nice. Schedule was relaxed, just to get rhythm up.
On the day of Paris - Nice stage 1, some riders have freshness BAD, making them virtually unusable, while some others have excellent.
Using random freshness for a race which is both sponsor and rider season goal makes any planning / buildup basically useless.
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| Rammus |
Posted on 03-08-2014 14:15
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Stagiare
Posts: 223
Joined: 08-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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d-s wrote:
On the day of Paris - Nice stage 1, some riders have freshness BAD, making them virtually unusable, while some others have excellent.
Did the riders who had bad freshness have Paris-Nice as a season goal though?
If they did have it as a season goal they should have excellent freshness provided you haven't put them in a race 1,2 or 3 days before (or a lot longer if it's after a GT.)
The freshness system could've been explained a lot better, that's for sure ... |
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| sobrano |
Posted on 10-08-2014 09:04
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 279
Joined: 21-01-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Lachi wrote:
I told you how it should work.
It's dangerous to say...cyanide release the game every year instead to fix the bugs of last version, it s rare that something work as it should work 
btw, I leave from pcm buying from several year bc i was really unhappy about low effort by cyanide to release a solid product (they are focused on yearly game releasing and not on good releasing)
Said that: what are the news about freshness? it is still considered random? or we still are not understanding a deep and intelligent cyanide implementation?
i read that: "a fraicheur, c'est le nombre de courses couru dans la semaine.un coureur qui a fait un échappé la veille aurait une fraicheur faible. un coureur avec une bonne note en récup est moins impacté "
this guy says that the freshness depends from the number of races in the week. If a rider did a stage so in the next morning he will get a bad freshness and a rider with a good recuperation is less affected.
what do u think about that?
Edited by sobrano on 10-08-2014 09:26
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| sobrano |
Posted on 12-08-2014 06:08
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 279
Joined: 21-01-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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someone knows if recuperation is linked with freshness? |
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| vismitananda |
Posted on 12-08-2014 10:31
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Domestique
Posts: 451
Joined: 23-02-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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sobrano wrote:
someone knows if recuperation is linked with freshness?
Of course they are related. A rider who has a better recuperation, recovers well on a stage race, even after attacking solo the previous stage. This feature has been around for some time, even before they introduced this "freshness" madness.
Edited by vismitananda on 12-08-2014 10:32
-Pain is temporary, Quitting lasts forever-
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