Deadpool wrote:
You know what, screw political correctness or whatever you want to call it. Sagan is doing something very unnatural. As a neo-pro, at the age of 20, he takes two wins in Paris-Nice, including a solo attack in the final kilometers of the stage, which is something that even the likes of Jens Voigt and Thomas Voeckler rarely succeed with. Not to mention that he takes fifth in the opening time-trial, in front of riders such as David Millar and Roman Kreuziger, despite the fact that he wasn't that good as a time-trialist as a junior.
It doesn't matter that it's early in the season, I'm going to come out and say that I am sure as hell that Sagan is doped up to his gills, and I know I'm going to get thrashed for this by the naive members of our forum, but fuck it.
Yes let's ban Sagan for 2 years because of too much talent
Deadpool wrote:
You know what, screw political correctness or whatever you want to call it. Sagan is doing something very unnatural. As a neo-pro, at the age of 20, he takes two wins in Paris-Nice, including a solo attack in the final kilometers of the stage, which is something that even the likes of Jens Voigt and Thomas Voeckler rarely succeed with. Not to mention that he takes fifth in the opening time-trial, in front of riders such as David Millar and Roman Kreuziger, despite the fact that he wasn't that good as a time-trialist as a junior.
It doesn't matter that it's early in the season, I'm going to come out and say that I am sure as hell that Sagan is doped up to his gills, and I know I'm going to get thrashed for this by the naive members of our forum, but fuck it.
Yes let's ban Sagan for 2 years because of too much talent
I knew you would be the first to respond.
Talent had nothing to do it. Him winning a sprint stage can be explained by talent. Him pulling off a 3km to go attack (the hardest attack in the sport of cycling, with longer distances you can get a gap before the chase really starts, shorter and the sprinters might not have time to react), and pulling off a result in a tt, which he wasn't very strong at in the past, against some of the top tters in the world is what sets me off. Talent can explain being up there in finishes like these, but to win this often in these ways as a 20 year old neo-pro against the top riders in the world is ridiculous.
Edited by Deadpool on 13-03-2010 00:54
He is already starting to annoy me, mainly because he hasn't spent any time in the peleton not getting results, like almost every other rider. That said, he seems to be a polite nice guy, and if he isn't caught doping in the next month or so then I will consider him as suspicious as every other rider in the peleton.
[url=www.pcmdaily.com/forum/viewthread.php?thread_id=33182]Team Santander Media Thread[/url]
Deadpool wrote:
You know what, screw political correctness or whatever you want to call it. Sagan is doing something very unnatural. As a neo-pro, at the age of 20, he takes two wins in Paris-Nice, including a solo attack in the final kilometers of the stage, which is something that even the likes of Jens Voigt and Thomas Voeckler rarely succeed with. Not to mention that he takes fifth in the opening time-trial, in front of riders such as David Millar and Roman Kreuziger, despite the fact that he wasn't that good as a time-trialist as a junior.
It doesn't matter that it's early in the season, I'm going to come out and say that I am sure as hell that Sagan is doped up to his gills, and I know I'm going to get thrashed for this by the naive members of our forum, but fuck it.
your right to think this, i think we all on here think this is the case, but we are not 100% sure so we must bite our lip, innocent until proven guilty, if he is clean then we are spoiling his moment, we have to respect he might be clean, even if we are 95% sure he isnt. Lets wait.
Deadpool wrote:
You know what, screw political correctness or whatever you want to call it. Sagan is doing something very unnatural. As a neo-pro, at the age of 20, he takes two wins in Paris-Nice, including a solo attack in the final kilometers of the stage, which is something that even the likes of Jens Voigt and Thomas Voeckler rarely succeed with. Not to mention that he takes fifth in the opening time-trial, in front of riders such as David Millar and Roman Kreuziger, despite the fact that he wasn't that good as a time-trialist as a junior.
It doesn't matter that it's early in the season, I'm going to come out and say that I am sure as hell that Sagan is doped up to his gills, and I know I'm going to get thrashed for this by the naive members of our forum, but fuck it.
Yes let's ban Sagan for 2 years because of too much talent
I knew you would be the first to respond.
Talent had nothing to do it. Him winning a sprint stage can be explained by talent. Him pulling off a 3km to go attack (the hardest attack in the sport of cycling, with longer distances you can get a gap before the chase really starts, shorter and the sprinters might not have time to react), and pulling off a result in a tt, which he wasn't very strong at in the past, against some of the top tters in the world is what sets me off. Talent can explain being up there in finishes like these, but to win this often in these ways as a 20 year old neo-pro against the top riders in the world is ridiculous.
I completely agree with your point of view on this matter. But let's face it: as you said more than 80% of the peloton is on drugs, which is true. Sagan is on drugs, maybe true. So, if Sagan is on drugs and more than half of the peloton is on drugs, how can he do that? Is he more doped than the others? If so, why?
I dont believe what are you writing here (especially Deadpool). How you can watch sport that is so rotten with dope by your opinion? If you think this about cycling, f**k off and go to curling forum.
And imho Sagan is the last rider in the peloton who have the reason to dope, 20 years old neo-pro will destroy his carrer by doping in his first season? Better explation for me is talent + superb fitness and motivation at the start of the season
Sorry if i annoy someone with this post, but i am here to read the opinions from cycling fans, most of the time very interesting and not to read the non-stop brainless accusations
I am not sure about the doping arguments - obviously like all of you I hope that Sagan in clean as a whistle.
But based on the evidence you have to believe that the Italian and Spanish teams have a lot to prove in terms of doping. Liquigas and Caisse d'Espagne in particular given their rosters of exciting riders mixed with a dodgy team caption or two are going to be under the suspicious spotlight until they get 2 to 3 years of clean riding.
Anyway onto to the racing today, which is probably the first chance I will get to watch some live racing this year. Looking at the profile any chance of some decisive attacking or will the riders wait for tomorrow?
What I love about the Paris - Nice is the way that so many riders could do something on any given day!
hellboy wrote:
I dont believe what are you writing here (especially Deadpool). How you can watch sport that is so rotten with dope by your opinion? If you think this about cycling, f**k off and go to curling forum.
And imho Sagan is the last rider in the peloton who have the reason to dope, 20 years old neo-pro will destroy his carrer by doping in his first season? Better explation for me is talent + superb fitness and motivation at the start of the season
Sorry if i annoy someone with this post, but i am here to read the opinions from cycling fans, most of the time very interesting and not to read the non-stop brainless accusations
Because we love the sport and can't help loving it. We love to ride a bike, and wish the doping wasn't there, but being naive doesn't help, and the reports we've got from ex dopers who help the anti doping cause (Kohl) suggest that it is even worse than we may think.
Anyway, I believe most sports are drug ridden. Curling probably is, some good Beta Blockers should come in handy.
Note to english people: your commentators are idiots. Stop immitating them saying "Caisse d'Espagne".
It's Epargne. It means "savings". It has nothing to do with "Spain". It's not even a spanish corporation. It's like saying Wiggins rides for team "Ski-lift".
Over and out.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
hellboy wrote:
And imho Sagan is the last rider in the peloton who have the reason to dope, 20 years old neo-pro will destroy his carrer by doping in his first season? Better explation for me is talent + superb fitness and motivation at the start of the season
Sorry if i annoy someone with this post, but i am here to read the opinions from cycling fans, most of the time very interesting and not to read the non-stop brainless accusations
Bollocks. Sagan has good reason to dope. neo-pro wants and needs results, lot's of access to dope in an italian team, help him on his way. he can become a leader incredibly quickly and get where he wants to be if he gets results in these races and the answere is dope.
and these accusations are not brainless. there is no proof but there is evidence, given that he's come in and done better against the pros than he did against the juniors. It indicates doping. It doesn't prove it but it does give a strong reason to believe this.
issoisso wrote:
Note to english people: your commentators are idiots. Stop immitating them saying "Caisse d'Espagne".
It's Epargne. It means "savings". It has nothing to do with "Spain". It's not even a spanish corporation. It's like saying Wiggins rides for team "Ski-lift".
Over and out.
The tirreno commentator guy? Ignore him, his primary job is commentating on motorbike racing
Oh, and Sagan is doped, i'm sure of it too. But until it's proved, i'm going to congratulate him.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
issoisso wrote:
Note to english people: your commentators are idiots. Stop immitating them saying "Caisse d'Espagne".
It's Epargne. It means "savings". It has nothing to do with "Spain". It's not even a spanish corporation. It's like saying Wiggins rides for team "Ski-lift".
Over and out.
I understand them. Even the most rabid Valverde's fanboys of Spain (those who, theoretically, must be better informed about the team) usually say Caisse D'Espagne.
So, it's clear why they'll cease to sponsor the team after this season. If after what, like 4 years, of sponsoring a top team, many cycling fans cannot say correctly your name, then it's time to pack up and leave.
