|
Tour de France, Stage 16 - Wednesday, Pau - Bagnères-de-Luchon
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:18
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15176
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Kirchen_75 wrote:
[quote]Likkivi wrote:
Officially the worst TdF ever.
you probably have mised few..even inside last decade |
| |
|
|
| Kirchen_75 |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:18
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7687
Joined: 24-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Guido Mukk wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
I'm not only talking about this race in terms of wheelsucking. Why would you attack when u have yellow jersey and time trial ahead? Wiggins has always been a wheelsucker its just his style, it may be effective but not attractive for fans. Thats why fans like attacking riders like Voeckler, Contador, Andy Schleck, Nibali, Gilbert and so on instead of Wiggins, Kloeden, Basso etc.
what has Basso done wrong..man just can not atack. He has non acceleration..diesel type climber. But has himself pulled and destroyed a field several times..
I'm not blaming Ivan for doing it wrong. I know he cant attack and he cant help it.
That doesnt make him fan favourite though does it? Thats my point. |
| |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:19
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15176
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Kirchen_75 wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
I'm not only talking about this race in terms of wheelsucking. Why would you attack when u have yellow jersey and time trial ahead? Wiggins has always been a wheelsucker its just his style, it may be effective but not attractive for fans. Thats why fans like attacking riders like Voeckler, Contador, Andy Schleck, Nibali, Gilbert and so on instead of Wiggins, Kloeden, Basso etc.
what has Basso done wrong..man just can not atack. He has non acceleration..diesel type climber. But has himself pulled and destroyed a field several times..
I'm not blaming Ivan for doing it wrong. I know he cant attack and he cant help it.
That doesnt make him fan favourite though does it? Thats my point.
correct |
| |
|
|
| Likkivi |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:20
|
Stagiare
Posts: 200
Joined: 30-09-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Kirchen_75 wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Officially the worst TdF ever.
What did u expect? putting Tourmalet with 120km to go is a blatant waste of a brilliant climb by A.S.O. No one gonna go for it with 120km to go.
That's my point. This is the worst route ever.
They have gradiently made them easier and easier in the previous year but this one tops it.
Not one stage finishing on a HC climb. Not 1 single stage where you can really make a difference. There are like what, 4?, mountain stages and they all suck.
Why has the Tour route become so pathetic compared to the Giro. |
| |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:21
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15176
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
if there ever will be made cycling movie Robin Williams should play Voeckler..or Jim Carrey |
| |
|
|
| Alakagom |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:21
|
World Champion
Posts: 10452
Joined: 19-11-2010
PCM$: 200.00
|
brownwm wrote:
Alakagom wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
I'm not only talking about this race in terms of wheelsucking. Why would you attack when u have yellow jersey and time trial ahead? Wiggins has always been a wheelsucker its just his style, it may be effective but not attractive for fans. Thats why fans like attacking riders like Voeckler, Contador, Andy Schleck, Nibali, Gilbert and so on instead of Wiggins, Kloeden, Basso etc.
Surely, I think almost all fans prefer attacking riding, myself too.
It's that I can't really call Wiggins a wheel-sucker who wheel-sucks the shit out of other riders. As he doesn't.
Perfect example of wheel-sucking was shown by Mr.Valverde or Levi at Mende in Paris Nice following Wiggins :
Spoiler
Begins about 1:30
Wiggins when runs out of domestiques will take control and set tempo - others will follow him. Wiggins doesn't have very good acceleration and so can't attack effectively and so follows this effective method for him, but one he doesn't really wheel-suck the shit out of his opponents 
However at no point during this tour has Wiggins pushed the paced in the mountains. He just hides behind Froome until he is dropped, then Froome has to wait for him. Just like in the Vuelta where Froome would have won if he didn't carry Wiggins up every climb. Contador used to win the mountain stages not just sit next to his rivals.
Well,indeed. Although Wiggins lead the small pack t one point when Froome felt bit weak ( I think he was faking it anyway  ). That's great for Wiggins he has amazing team-mate though. If he didn't, Wiggins would had to do much more work by himslef. Wiggins has 2 minutes advantage over Froome and Wiggins looks comfortable to other favourites in mountains and so going with Wiggins here is the right decision.
Vuelta last year was Sky's DS there mistake. It was Wiggins first race back from inujury and he got worse as the Vuelta went on - Froome should have been made the leader after the TT.
|
| |
|
|
| Pellizotti2 |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:21
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 9885
Joined: 01-05-2010
PCM$: 200.00
|
Fuck, there goes the KoM jersey for Kessiakoff. 
|
| |
|
|
| brownwm |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:22
|
Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 862
Joined: 16-01-2010
PCM$: 200.00
|
Likkivi wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Officially the worst TdF ever.
What did u expect? putting Tourmalet with 120km to go is a blatant waste of a brilliant climb by A.S.O. No one gonna go for it with 120km to go.
That's my point. This is the worst route ever.
They have gradiently made them easier and easier in the previous year but this one tops it.
Not one stage finishing on a HC climb. Not 1 single stage where you can really make a difference. There are like what, 4?, mountain stages and they all suck.
Why has the Tour route become so pathetic compared to the Giro.
I have heard they are saving some of the big climbs for next years tour as it is the 100th. However I still totally agree. No time gaps between favourites unless they crack, similar to last year.
|
| |
|
|
| doddy13 |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:22
|
Team Leader
Posts: 7104
Joined: 04-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Likkivi wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Officially the worst TdF ever.
What did u expect? putting Tourmalet with 120km to go is a blatant waste of a brilliant climb by A.S.O. No one gonna go for it with 120km to go.
That's my point. This is the worst route ever.
They have gradiently made them easier and easier in the previous year but this one tops it.
Not one stage finishing on a HC climb. Not 1 single stage where you can really make a difference. There are like what, 4?, mountain stages and they all suck.
Why has the Tour route become so pathetic compared to the Giro.
Not totally this reason, because HC finishes can happen.
BUT.. The Tour has become too big for its own good. A finish must accomodate the worlds media, the Giro has a much much smaller following. Yes it's shown on Eurosport, but they don't commentate on site (like most broadcasters do at the Tour).
Compare the size of the Giro and Tour followings, it's really interesting.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
|
| |
|
|
| Kirchen_75 |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:22
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7687
Joined: 24-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Likkivi wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Officially the worst TdF ever.
What did u expect? putting Tourmalet with 120km to go is a blatant waste of a brilliant climb by A.S.O. No one gonna go for it with 120km to go.
That's my point. This is the worst route ever.
They have gradiently made them easier and easier in the previous year but this one tops it.
Not one stage finishing on a HC climb. Not 1 single stage where you can really make a difference. There are like what, 4?, mountain stages and they all suck.
Why has the Tour route become so pathetic compared to the Giro.
This years Giro had a good route but the riders refused to race. De Gendt and Hesjedal capitalised |
| |
|
|
| Ad Bot |
Posted on 19-12-2025 12:33
|
Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
|
|
| IP: None |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:23
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15176
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Likkivi wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Officially the worst TdF ever.
What did u expect? putting Tourmalet with 120km to go is a blatant waste of a brilliant climb by A.S.O. No one gonna go for it with 120km to go.
That's my point. This is the worst route ever.
They have gradiently made them easier and easier in the previous year but this one tops it.
Not one stage finishing on a HC climb. Not 1 single stage where you can really make a difference. There are like what, 4?, mountain stages and they all suck.
Why has the Tour route become so pathetic compared to the Giro.
This year Giro profile was booring as hell. |
| |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:24
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15176
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Pellizotti2 wrote:
Fuck, there goes the KoM jersey for Kessiakoff.
easy..just let better guy win. |
| |
|
|
| brownwm |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:24
|
Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 862
Joined: 16-01-2010
PCM$: 200.00
|
Alakagom wrote:
brownwm wrote:
Alakagom wrote:
Kirchen_75 wrote:
I'm not only talking about this race in terms of wheelsucking. Why would you attack when u have yellow jersey and time trial ahead? Wiggins has always been a wheelsucker its just his style, it may be effective but not attractive for fans. Thats why fans like attacking riders like Voeckler, Contador, Andy Schleck, Nibali, Gilbert and so on instead of Wiggins, Kloeden, Basso etc.
Surely, I think almost all fans prefer attacking riding, myself too.
It's that I can't really call Wiggins a wheel-sucker who wheel-sucks the shit out of other riders. As he doesn't.
Perfect example of wheel-sucking was shown by Mr.Valverde or Levi at Mende in Paris Nice following Wiggins :
Spoiler
Begins about 1:30
Wiggins when runs out of domestiques will take control and set tempo - others will follow him. Wiggins doesn't have very good acceleration and so can't attack effectively and so follows this effective method for him, but one he doesn't really wheel-suck the shit out of his opponents
However at no point during this tour has Wiggins pushed the paced in the mountains. He just hides behind Froome until he is dropped, then Froome has to wait for him. Just like in the Vuelta where Froome would have won if he didn't carry Wiggins up every climb. Contador used to win the mountain stages not just sit next to his rivals.
Well,indeed. Although Wiggins lead the small pack t one point when Froome felt bit weak ( I think he was faking it anyway ). That's great for Wiggins he has amazing team-mate though. If he didn't, Wiggins would had to do much more work by himslef. Wiggins has 2 minutes advantage over Froome and Wiggins looks comfortable to other favourites in mountains and so going with Wiggins here is the right decision.
Vuelta last year was Sky's DS there mistake. It was Wiggins first race back from inujury and he got worse as the Vuelta went on - Froome should have been made the leader after the TT.
Fair enough, but I want to see what Wiggins can actually do by himself. Also don't think he would be able to stick with Contador and Schleck, but hopefully we will see next year.
|
| |
|
|
| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:32
|
World Champion
Posts: 13662
Joined: 20-06-2011
PCM$: 300.00
|
Guido Mukk wrote:
if there ever will be made cycling movie Robin Williams should play Voeckler..or Jim Carrey
i would save Carrey for Cris Anker 
|
| |
|
|
| kumazan |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:33
|
Team Leader
Posts: 6195
Joined: 02-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
if there ever will be made cycling movie Robin Williams should play Voeckler..or Jim Carrey
i would save Carrey for Cris Anker
No way. Jim Carrey couldn't be more than 3 seconds with the same face.
|
| |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:34
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15176
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Vino is looking better and better after every climb |
| |
|
|
| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:34
|
World Champion
Posts: 13662
Joined: 20-06-2011
PCM$: 300.00
|
kumazan wrote:
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
if there ever will be made cycling movie Robin Williams should play Voeckler..or Jim Carrey
i would save Carrey for Cris Anker
No way. Jim Carrey couldn't be more than 3 seconds with the same face.
True, no one can do that bar CAS himself
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 18-07-2012 14:35
|
| |
|
|
| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:35
|
World Champion
Posts: 13662
Joined: 20-06-2011
PCM$: 300.00
|
Guido Mukk wrote:
Vino is looking better and better after every climb
Yeah, go Vino, this is you last chance in the whole life here!
|
| |
|
|
| Kirchen_75 |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:36
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7687
Joined: 24-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Ok my prediction for the stage:
1. Voeckler
2. Feillu
3. EBH
4. Knees
5. Rogers
6. Porte
7. Froome
8. Wiggins
9. Evans
10. Nibbles
Edited by Kirchen_75 on 18-07-2012 14:36
|
| |
|
|
| kumazan |
Posted on 18-07-2012 14:36
|
Team Leader
Posts: 6195
Joined: 02-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
True, no one can do that bar CAS himself
The world of poker has lost such a legend with CAS.
|
| |
|
