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PCM.daily DB Stats discussion
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| admirschleck |
Posted on 22-07-2014 09:35
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Team Leader
Posts: 6566
Joined: 11-10-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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Yeah, if YOU play with him. What about the situation when you choose to play as another team and he starts failing hard, because the game is not programmed so that certain guy only follow others wheel and get valuable points there?
Edited by admirschleck on 22-07-2014 09:35
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| dark_x2012 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 09:44
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 856
Joined: 13-05-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Ok fine. I admit PCM wouldn't give him the results with 78 sprint so I'll stop here. |
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 22-07-2014 10:10
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World Champion
Posts: 13660
Joined: 20-06-2011
PCM$: 300.00
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Sagan is always underrated in every Daily database. I was fighting this fight Admir...it is lost before the battle. 
He cant sprint at all, but he has almost a dozen of top5 finishes, sounds logical?
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 22-07-2014 10:12
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 22-07-2014 10:25
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World Champion
Posts: 14743
Joined: 21-07-2012
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78 sprint is ''can't sprint at all''? With his amazing ACC and FL and HI too? 
That said, it is likely he'll end up at 79SP.
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| jarneke1404 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 10:28
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Under 23
Posts: 67
Joined: 21-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZaK wrote:
About sprinters I think:
Cavendish 83
Kittel 83
Greipel 81
Kristoff 81
Degenkolb 79
Sagan 79
Demare 79
Bouhanni 79
Viviani 79
I think Greipel deserves +1 , and ACC at around 80 or 79. And what are your ACC stats of those riders? |
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 22-07-2014 10:46
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World Champion
Posts: 13660
Joined: 20-06-2011
PCM$: 300.00
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Jesleyh wrote:
78 sprint is ''can't sprint at all''? With his amazing ACC and FL and HI too?
That said, it is likely he'll end up at 79SP.
That was reference wo one of the earlier posts in this thread, about just wheelsucking Kittel. Because staying in his wheel is so easy...
79 is what i would give him too, if Kittel should be 83.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 11-09-2026 18:35
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 22-07-2014 10:47
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World Champion
Posts: 14743
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Yes, Kittel will be 83.
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| admirschleck |
Posted on 22-07-2014 10:47
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Team Leader
Posts: 6566
Joined: 11-10-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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To be fair, 78 indeed is "can't sprint at all" when you compare it to beast like a Kittel. But yeah, seems like we all agree on making him 79 and high ACC. 
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| jarneke1404 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 12:55
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Under 23
Posts: 67
Joined: 21-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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But if Kittel is 83 , and Cav is also 83 ,then, how do you guys explain the fact that in every duel (kittel-cav) kittel won. Cav has never beaten kittel, so there must be a difference between those two |
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| madzdaman |
Posted on 22-07-2014 13:23
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Stagiare
Posts: 187
Joined: 26-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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I seem to think that Cav should have maybe 82 sprint and 84 acceleration, whereas Kittel should have 84 sprint with 82 accel. Kittel is faster, but is more of a Leadout sprinter, unlike Cav. all the other sprinters should be lower than those two |
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| OPQS93 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 13:28
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Stagiare
Posts: 211
Joined: 10-07-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZaK wrote:
About sprinters I think:
Cavendish 83
Kittel 83
Greipel 81
Kristoff 81
Degenkolb 79
Sagan 79
Demare 79
Bouhanni 79
Viviani 79
I think Kristoff should have 80. Its not speed he wins most on, but stamina and REC/RES(always mix those two...)
And think kittel should be little faster than Cav, but not much like 83-82 but Cav with better ACC |
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| dark_x2012 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 13:44
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 856
Joined: 13-05-2013
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jarneke1404 wrote:
But if Kittel is 83 , and Cav is also 83 ,then, how do you guys explain the fact that in every duel (kittel-cav) kittel won. Cav has never beaten kittel, so there must be a difference between those two
In 2013 Cav had the giro in his legs + several misfortunes in TDF stages. In 2014 there was no Kittel vs Cav
Edited by dark_x2012 on 22-07-2014 13:45
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| The Hobbit |
Posted on 22-07-2014 14:25
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2709
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PCM$: 200.00
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What about Coquard. He has shown in a pure sprint he is as quick or maybe quicker than Sagan, so is he 79,80 or what? |
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| Dusen |
Posted on 22-07-2014 14:30
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1173
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Sagan is still 80 in my opinion.
And i think Kittel has to be rated higher than Cav in some way.
Perhaps Cav 82 but then instead a better ACC.
Besides that i think Kittel should have a go down in hill and mountains (most hills) cause damn he is useless as soon as they hit a bump on the road |
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| jarneke1404 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 14:41
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Under 23
Posts: 67
Joined: 21-07-2011
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The Hobbit wrote:
What about Coquard. He has shown in a pure sprint he is as quick or maybe quicker than Sagan, so is he 79,80 or what?
I have him at 80SP 82ACC |
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| depeche92 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 15:09
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Domestique
Posts: 451
Joined: 24-08-2009
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The Hobbit wrote:
What about Coquard. He has shown in a pure sprint he is as quick or maybe quicker than Sagan, so is he 79,80 or what?
And when did he show that? Sagan beat him in every sprint of this tdf. Please don't tell me the intermediate sprint
Coquard at 78 is fine. The Sagan hate here is unbelievable.
The only change I would do after TDF is Kristoff at 80 and Navardauskas 77...
Kittel 83 Cav 82 Greipel 81 Kristoff 80 Sagan,Demare,Bouhanni,Degenkolb 79 |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 15:21
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 17059
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 16838.70
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admirschleck wrote:
Yeah, if YOU play with him. What about the situation when you choose to play as another team and he starts failing hard, because the game is not programmed so that certain guy only follow others wheel and get valuable points there?
People said the same thing about his hill before, but in the end it's not only about the results he can get, but the ones he can't.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| toon83 |
Posted on 22-07-2014 20:43
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Under 23
Posts: 87
Joined: 14-09-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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So are we settling on 80 sp for sagan?
what about his flat, cob, acc, hil, res, rec and stamina stats?
And would anyone have bouhanni at higher stats than Demare? |
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| Naskela |
Posted on 22-07-2014 21:10
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Stagiare
Posts: 204
Joined: 31-05-2014
PCM$: 300.00
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admirschleck wrote:
Lolwut Sagan at 78? How can you get [url=hhttps://www.procyclingstats.com/rider/Peter_Sagan]those results[/url] with 78 SP? Okay, he's not the fastest guy, but 5 stats below Kittel? That's way too much. He's between 79 and 80 for me.
He is nowhere near the same he was last year and the year before in a flat sprint he would never beat riders like Kittel and Cavendish so i think 78 is fair, his backup stats would make him a favorite in most hilly stages anyway which makes it realistic. 78 is still pretty good stats, in my db Coquard, Viviani and Modolo is all 78 and Sagan with his backup stats (ACC,END) would make him far better than those i mentioned even in a flat sprint and finish top 5 in pretty much every flat stage in the tour which also is realistic comparing from his results this TDF.
And would anyone have bouhanni at higher stats than Demare? I think i have him at 80 while Demare is 79, he is more of a classical sprinter so his backup stats make him better even with 79.
Edited by Naskela on 22-07-2014 21:17
AG2R La Mondiale / Issy Paris Hand / Le Havre AC
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 22-07-2014 21:43
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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The big problem dropping Sagan below 80sp is that he's probably not going to earn enough points to really challenge for the points jersey in the TDF. Sure he's got a lot of climbing stats better than other sprinters but the AI doesn't always use this to his benefit. Therefore to challenge he needs to consistently be guaranteed to pick up points in the sprints and 80 kind of guarantees that he will be in with a strong chance to do so. |
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