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PCM.daily DB Stats discussion
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| jacobjc88 |
Posted on 30-06-2014 23:13
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Domestique
Posts: 420
Joined: 13-03-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
toon83 wrote:
Does anyone have a full stat update on Wout Poels?
I believe he deserves an upgrade but am not sure what he should be upgraded to.
In the main stats I have him like this
Mtn 76
Hill 75
TT 72
Pro 69
Rec 68 (which does seem low)
Acc 75
Well Poels do have some often days quite often
Present:
Tinkoff-Saxo - AG2R - Colombian riders
Past:
Francisco Mancebo - Illes balears - Carlos Sastre - Kelme - Robbie McEwen
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| sgdanny |
Posted on 03-07-2014 13:18
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3587
Joined: 18-03-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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Hi
I know this isn't the right place to ask this, but it's related to Stat Discussions. Do anyone have stats for EPM - UNE and Movistar Team Ecuador ?
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| Jorge14 |
Posted on 08-07-2014 19:35
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Stagiare
Posts: 184
Joined: 15-03-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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90SP 90ACC to Kittel ? |
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| totto |
Posted on 10-07-2014 16:30
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Junior Rider
Posts: 26
Joined: 18-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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What about Nibali's cobble stat considering yesterday's stage? (and considering game balance and season planning AI) |
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| dark_x2012 |
Posted on 10-07-2014 16:51
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 856
Joined: 13-05-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Nibali 71-72 cobbles at least
Baring in mind Froome once again proved he's the weakest bike handler of all time no more than 55 on cobbles. The rest I think are fine.
Edited by dark_x2012 on 10-07-2014 16:52
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 11:23
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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But he didn't even ride on any cobbles and crashed before the first pave stage. |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 11-09-2026 18:48
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Bot Agent
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| dark_x2012 |
Posted on 11-07-2014 11:29
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 856
Joined: 13-05-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
But he didn't even ride on any cobbles and crashed before the first pave stage.
Exactly he has fallen even before them, because of awful bike handling skills what remains on them. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 11:34
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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dark_x2012 wrote:
Tafiolmo wrote:
But he didn't even ride on any cobbles and crashed before the first pave stage.
Exactly he has fallen even before them, because of awful bike handling skills what remains on them.
So why give him 55 on cobbles when he hasn't even ridden over them!!! |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 11-07-2014 11:46
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15229
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 11500.00
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I find it hard to imagine Froome taking cobbles well, seeing his general bikehandling 
To be honest, I was more impressed by Fuglsang then by Nibali on the cobbles. He can go 1-2 points above Nibali imo.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 12:04
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Ollfardh wrote:
I find it hard to imagine Froome taking cobbles well, seeing his general bikehandling
To be honest, I was more impressed by Fuglsang then by Nibali on the cobbles. He can go 1-2 points above Nibali imo.
Yes but it's guesswork as he didn't ride them and he had a bad wrist as well. The only thing we do know though is that Nibali is much better over cobbles than Contador from the big GC contenders. |
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| dark_x2012 |
Posted on 11-07-2014 12:17
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 856
Joined: 13-05-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
I find it hard to imagine Froome taking cobbles well, seeing his general bikehandling
To be honest, I was more impressed by Fuglsang then by Nibali on the cobbles. He can go 1-2 points above Nibali imo.
Yes but it's guesswork as he didn't ride them and he had a bad wrist as well. The only thing we do know though is that Nibali is much better over cobbles than Contador from the big GC contenders.
Only from Contador . Also answer me a question. What does it take to be a good rider on cobbles? When you understand the answer is bike handling write back. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 12:26
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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dark_x2012 wrote:
Tafiolmo wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
I find it hard to imagine Froome taking cobbles well, seeing his general bikehandling
To be honest, I was more impressed by Fuglsang then by Nibali on the cobbles. He can go 1-2 points above Nibali imo.
Yes but it's guesswork as he didn't ride them and he had a bad wrist as well. The only thing we do know though is that Nibali is much better over cobbles than Contador from the big GC contenders.
Only from Contador . Also answer me a question. What does it take to be a good rider on cobbles? When you understand the answer is bike handling write back.
Very easy answer really and I'm surprised that you don't know it, so I'll help you out.
Years of experience practicing on cobbles in all conditions, something that the big GC riders don't have. But if they focus for one specific event like Wiggins did at the PR this year or as Nibali has done for this stage then they can produce something. Contador we saw wasn't able to and as for a fully fit Chris Froome we still don't know.
So when you grasp these facts, feel free to answer back laddy |
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| dark_x2012 |
Posted on 11-07-2014 12:33
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 856
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Tafiolmo wrote:
Very easy answer really and I'm surprised that you don't know it, so I'll help you out.
Years of experience practicing on cobbles in all conditions, something that the big GC riders don't have. But if they focus for one specific event like Wiggins did at the PR this year or as Nibali has done for this stage then they can produce something. Contador we saw wasn't able to and as for a fully fit Chris Froome we still don't know.
So when you grasp these facts, feel free to answer back laddy.
I meant what talent do you need. A fully fit Froome still doesn't have what it takes to handle his bike properly on cobbles. |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 11-07-2014 12:41
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15229
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 11500.00
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So Tafiolmo, what would you suggest for a rider who 1) has no experience 2) has no results 3) doesn't seem capable of it because of other factors? Surely not higher than 60?
Maybe not just Froome, but let's say Tom Van Asbroeck wants to conquer Alpe d'Huez. He has no experience, no results and he's doesn't give the impression of being a good climber. It's hard to rate him over 60 mountain, is it not?
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 12:57
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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dark_x2012 wrote:
[quote]Tafiolmo wrote:
I meant what talent do you need. A fully fit Froome still doesn't have what it takes to handle his bike properly on cobbles.
Speaking with the PCMdaily stats for cobbles. Nibali, Contador and Froome all have around 62/63 on cobbles which means that they're pretty poor on cobbles. It's clear that Nibali needs an improvement to around 71/72 for example, but there's no need to put Froome down to 55 especially when 1) he didn't ride the cobbles 2) 62/63 is a poor level anyway and 3) Contador's ride warrants a 62/63 stat anyway and there's no indication that a fully fit Froome would've performed worse than Contador. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 13:01
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
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Ollfardh wrote:
So Tafiolmo, what would you suggest for a rider who 1) has no experience 2) has no results 3) doesn't seem capable of it because of other factors? Surely not higher than 60?
Maybe not just Froome, but let's say Tom Van Asbroeck wants to conquer Alpe d'Huez. He has no experience, no results and he's doesn't give the impression of being a good climber. It's hard to rate him over 60 mountain, is it not?
Froome has 62/63 and that sounds good to me, as we have no indicators that this should be raised or lowered and probably never will do, as I imagine he has no plans to tackle the cobbles in the near future.
The Van Ashbroek example is repeating more or less what I've been saying from the beginning. You can't lower a rider as in Froome's case, if he didn't actually ride the cobbles in question and as said his low stat is adequate as it is. |
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| dark_x2012 |
Posted on 11-07-2014 13:14
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 856
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Then why does Froome have more cobbles than Quintana when we have no real indicator. Once again, Froome doesn't have:
1) Skills needed to ride well on cobbles;
2) Experience on cobbles;
3) Result on cobbles.
Most of the GC riders have raced at least once before in past tours. Quintana and Froome are the ones that haven't done so. Why should the one have 8 cobbles more and to be equal to the rest of GC contenders unlike the other one. |
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 11-07-2014 13:29
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1350
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Yeah, can't see why Froome should have over 60 COB when he has the worst bike handling in the peloton. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-07-2014 13:42
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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dark_x2012 wrote:
Then why does Froome have more cobbles than Quintana when we have no real indicator. Once again, Froome doesn't have:
1) Skills needed to ride well on cobbles;
2) Experience on cobbles;
3) Result on cobbles.
Most of the GC riders have raced at least once before in past tours. Quintana and Froome are the ones that haven't done so. Why should the one have 8 cobbles more and to be equal to the rest of GC contenders unlike the other one.
Well Froome is far better than Quintana in both flat and TT making him by default a likely better rider over cobbles than Quintana (even though both hardly have any experience) and I'm also following stat logic here, as there are very few strong cobble riders that don't have strong flat skills as well.
The nearest indicator for Froome would be Wiggins similar in that he has strong flat and TT skills and he also proved what a poor bike handler he was in the Giro 2013, but then still focused on this year's PR and rode a great race. |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 11-07-2014 13:55
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15229
Joined: 08-08-2011
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Tafiolmo wrote:
The nearest indicator for Froome would be Wiggins similar in that he has strong flat and TT skills and he also proved what a poor bike handler he was in the Giro 2013, but then still focused on this year's PR and rode a great race.
I have to disagree with that, Wiggins was just the 2013 Giro where he didn't know what to do. Froome has been very consistent in not knowing how to ride a bike. I can still see him crashing in the TT championship 
Froome good on the flat can also be disputed, looking back at last year's echelon stage.
I compare Froome on cobbles to a 90kg cobbler trying to climb, it's just not going to happen. I have to agree Quintana seems highly unlikely as well, for that matter.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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