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How to use a fighter
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| LLDS |
Posted on 23-02-2013 09:24
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Domestique
Posts: 699
Joined: 10-02-2013
PCM$: 400.00
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I have in my team the best fighter in the game : Jens Voigt (in the original DB is Jan Vagt).
How do I use a rider like that ? Is the best fighter in the game, by far. But I don't know how to use him, in what type of races and how to make him win.
First, I thought to use him in some breakaway in the beginning of the flat stages, but is very difficult to keep him in front until the end of race. Other solution is to make a breakaway at the half of the race, but the pace is high.
What do you do with a rider like this ?
Here is him :
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| SuperKid |
Posted on 23-02-2013 09:33
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Under 23
Posts: 61
Joined: 28-09-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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First of all, get Dailys 2013 DB. Looking at the original makes me sick 
I would usually attack on hilly sprint stages with 10-30 km's to go. The pace is usually not as high as on a flit stage, if there are some hills to tire the sprinter teams.
Keep the pace high when riding alone. Always make sure that you are gaining time on the peloton, but if it looks like a lost case you should keep having him out there. Nobody knows, what might happen in the peloton. |
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| Kentaurus |
Posted on 23-02-2013 09:48
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3991
Joined: 26-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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The game is generally very realistic, Jens isn't really going to win any races (or very rarely), the best chance is during a stage race, get into a breakaway, then hope the breakaway will stay out front, and then attack that breakaway as you get close (~15km) and try to hold them off.
Fighters are not normally going to win races, but they can make very good domestiques, especially for sprinters.
2nd: Get the 2013 db. Much improved game experience.
AZTECA - NBCSN  |
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| LLDS |
Posted on 23-02-2013 10:36
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Domestique
Posts: 699
Joined: 10-02-2013
PCM$: 400.00
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Thanks SuperKid and Kentaurus.
I know that Voigt isn't a winner but a team-mate, but I hoped to take advantage of the 85 FTR stat.
Regarding the 2013 DB, I didn't really understand how to install it. I didn't install any DB. I read that I have to copy the game folder, or the game has 6 Go, my hard drive is almost full. But I think I didn't get the correct idea. And I didn't find the link to download the DB 2013.
I would like to be able to continue this career (I am in the 3rd season) and to play another carer with the 2013 DB in the same time. |
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| Iguwell |
Posted on 23-02-2013 11:29
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Domestique
Posts: 423
Joined: 18-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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The fighter stat has no effect.
Edited by Iguwell on 23-02-2013 11:30
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 23-02-2013 12:46
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 21379
Joined: 01-05-2012
PCM$: 400.00
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What Iguwell means is that the FIGHTER stat doesn't affect his strength as a rider. The stat only affects the AI. Riders with a higher stat will attack more. Since you're playing with him, you get to chose his attacks, so it has no effect. |
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 23-02-2013 14:47
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8425
Joined: 30-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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LLDS wrote:
Thanks SuperKid and Kentaurus.
I know that Voigt isn't a winner but a team-mate, but I hoped to take advantage of the 85 FTR stat.
Regarding the 2013 DB, I didn't really understand how to install it. I didn't install any DB. I read that I have to copy the game folder, or the game has 6 Go, my hard drive is almost full. But I think I didn't get the correct idea. And I didn't find the link to download the DB 2013.
I would like to be able to continue this career (I am in the 3rd season) and to play another carer with the 2013 DB in the same time.
If you haven't installed any DB, you don't need to make any copy, just run the .exe installation file, read the instructions and install. The download link can be found in downloads section, or in the "latest downloads" in the right menu. As I said in the other thread, installing the Daily's DB will not force you to stop your current career.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 08-12-2025 15:55
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| LLDS |
Posted on 23-02-2013 15:54
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Domestique
Posts: 699
Joined: 10-02-2013
PCM$: 400.00
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For the Fighter, I read on this forum :
"Fighter: while working in a breakaway a rider will experience a similar energy sapping effect as to riding on cobbles. the very act of being away from the peleton drains on the riders. having a high Fighter stat will work to counteract this effect just as a high Cobbles stat will counteract the rough stuff. this is easily proven with Jens Voigt, whos 85 Fighter skill allows him to preform virtually the same whether alone, with a small group, or in the bunch. (NOTE: this stat DOES NOT effect how often a rider will attack if controlled by AI.)"
I assume CosmicOsmo (the one who wrote this) is wrong and judging by the way the discussion continued maybe he is wrong.
For the DB, I found where to download, but ... is 8.5 G. I thought that the DB is only a file with the riders, teams, and equipment for 2013, but that seems to be a new game . Yup, definitely, I can not download an install this, at least until April. i have a limited internet download here in Morocco (about 2 G per month) but when I'll be back home I'll try to download it and install it. Thanks  . |
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 23-02-2013 16:09
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8425
Joined: 30-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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Indeed the DB is very heavy The stages are probably what takes the most space for the less files. For example, only of new variants in the 2013 DB, there are more than 2 GB of files...
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| scoopy |
Posted on 27-02-2013 11:34
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Amateur
Posts: 21
Joined: 12-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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Going back to the OP question, I find riders like Jens Voigt/Jan Vagt useful for four purposes. Firstly, for using as the lead rider in a sprint train between about 10-3km to the finish. He won't actually participate in the lead out, but will help keep your train near the front, especially when an AI team are making the chase pace on flat stages. Secondly, I use fighters to help bring back breakaways on hillier stages. Thirdly, I try and put them in, or get them across to breakaways that contain an AI rider who is dangerous to my stage objective, simply to mark or ride at the back of the group. Lastly, I use them to protect my best GC rider during the flatter stages of a GT. I find that it frees up and helps the recovery and stamina of my supporting climber(s) who would usually be protecting my GC rider on the more mountainous days. That being said, you don't often need to protect your GC rider on the flatter stages, depending on how strong he is. So yes, they make excellent teammates, and become more valuable when you are playing career mode and have several races on the same day. |
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| cio93 |
Posted on 27-02-2013 13:44
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World Champion
Posts: 10616
Joined: 29-10-2007
PCM$: 500.00
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Sure, but these purposes are all derived from a good flat stat.
To illustrate it in an extreme way, a 77FL/50FGH rider will to theses tasks better than a 76FL/85FGH rider.
It is common that good fighter stat comes with good flat stat, but keep in mind that fighter really does nothing.
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| CosmicOsmo |
Posted on 01-03-2013 09:56
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Under 23
Posts: 90
Joined: 17-04-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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cio93 wrote:
Sure, but these purposes are all derived from a good flat stat.
To illustrate it in an extreme way, a 77FL/50FGH rider will to theses tasks better than a 76FL/85FGH rider.
It is common that good fighter stat comes with good flat stat, but keep in mind that fighter really does nothing.
this is wrong and easily tested as i have done a million times and attempted to show this forum. i suggest the OP tries the test him/herself to see how the Fighter stat works in game.
Breakaways are scripted and are not directly "high fighter skill selectors"
top 10 of all time in no particular order, not including the cannibal cause hes automatically #1:
-Gemininani -Nencini -Anquetil -Coppi
-Kelly -Hinault -Zabel -Bettini -Rebellin -Magni
..and honorable mention to Tom Simpson whos career was cut short.
Top 5 noobs most likely to tear it up this season:
-Phinney -Moser -TJ -Guardini -DURBO!
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| Lachi |
Posted on 01-03-2013 12:44
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8360
Joined: 29-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Maybe you want to provide the link to one of your test results.
Edited by Lachi on 01-03-2013 12:53
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| CosmicOsmo |
Posted on 03-03-2013 11:46
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Under 23
Posts: 90
Joined: 17-04-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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a quick forum search will answer all your questions lachi. its an old issue...
top 10 of all time in no particular order, not including the cannibal cause hes automatically #1:
-Gemininani -Nencini -Anquetil -Coppi
-Kelly -Hinault -Zabel -Bettini -Rebellin -Magni
..and honorable mention to Tom Simpson whos career was cut short.
Top 5 noobs most likely to tear it up this season:
-Phinney -Moser -TJ -Guardini -DURBO!
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| Lachi |
Posted on 03-03-2013 14:24
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8360
Joined: 29-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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I have no questions, but I don't like it if somebody deliberatly doesn't post a link.
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| scoopy |
Posted on 04-03-2013 01:41
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Amateur
Posts: 21
Joined: 12-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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cio93 wrote:
Sure, but these purposes are all derived from a good flat stat.
To illustrate it in an extreme way, a 77FL/50FGH rider will to theses tasks better than a 76FL/85FGH rider.
It is common that good fighter stat comes with good flat stat, but keep in mind that fighter really does nothing.
I hear ya, but that's why I said 'riders like Jans Vagt' and not 'fighter'. I only really play in career mode; so fighters (unless they have enough potential to be retrained) only stay in my team for the default length of their contract at the career start. I find that time trialists and cobble specialists usually have half decent flat stats as well. They're far more versatile and are better suited to the demands of a full season.
So, Fighters are most definitely limited, but not entirely useless, depending on the quality/progression of their stats. I'm sure you'll agree that they make excellent bottle carriers. |
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| CosmicOsmo |
Posted on 04-03-2013 02:02
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Under 23
Posts: 90
Joined: 17-04-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Lachi wrote:
I have no questions, but I don't like it if somebody deliberatly doesn't post a link.
i could post you links but considering the whole "what does the fighter stat do?" has been answered about 6 million times on this forum i assumed it wasnt necessary. theres been much debate over how breaks work in the game and the consensus (which has been the product of anecdotal and empirical experience) is that breaks are scripted and do not happened based simply on the FIGHTER stat but on many many factors. (its all in the games code which considering your lachi....im guessing you know that)
as far as my own empirical data stretches i can assure you riders with high fighter stats do indeed tire less when away from the bunch. in earlier editions of the game the mysterious "green bar blink" was also attributed to that stat although ive never seen green bar blink in the 2012 version of the game myself and i couldnt tell you where the code for that would be. id post you a link to that but the OP already copypastaed it earlier.
Edited by CosmicOsmo on 04-03-2013 02:04
top 10 of all time in no particular order, not including the cannibal cause hes automatically #1:
-Gemininani -Nencini -Anquetil -Coppi
-Kelly -Hinault -Zabel -Bettini -Rebellin -Magni
..and honorable mention to Tom Simpson whos career was cut short.
Top 5 noobs most likely to tear it up this season:
-Phinney -Moser -TJ -Guardini -DURBO!
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| Kentaurus |
Posted on 04-03-2013 03:20
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3991
Joined: 26-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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CosmicOsmo wrote:
Lachi wrote:
I have no questions, but I don't like it if somebody deliberatly doesn't post a link.
as far as my own empirical data stretches i can assure you riders with high fighter stats do indeed tire less when away from the bunch. in earlier editions of the game the mysterious "green bar blink" was also attributed to that stat although ive never seen green bar blink in the 2012 version of the game myself and i couldnt tell you where the code for that would be. id post you a link to that but the OP already copypastaed it earlier.
Well your empirical data is wrong. As others have told you before.
Here is a picture of me with two identical riders (except 1 has 85 fighter, the other is 65) the Green bar is basically the same (actually the one with 65 is slightly better, presumably based on his +1 form).
Here are two of me having them both attack at the same time. They tire at exactly the same rate, same time, same distance (Havik gets a bit ahead due to taking 3 left turns).
Here I send them both to sprint, same as attacking, speed, acceleration, decrease in red/yellow bars both the same.
These two riders made the break on their own, were out in front on this race from the very start.
EDIT: Here is a 2nd trial, this time instead of the two riders using relay, they both used dot effort.
Also the flashing green bar has been replaced by a flashing red bar, effect is the same as before, perhaps the chance of getting this bonus is affected by the fighter stat, though not enough data to prove either way.
Edited by Kentaurus on 04-03-2013 03:32
AZTECA - NBCSN |
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| dren |
Posted on 04-03-2013 15:01
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Under 23
Posts: 77
Joined: 13-09-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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i had done tests for fighter in different pcm's and never found a effect in my riders, i will do the flashing red test now |
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| dren |
Posted on 04-03-2013 15:42
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Under 23
Posts: 77
Joined: 13-09-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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flashing red test:
i started a race 20 times, always 4 riders with 50 fighter and others 4 with 85 fighter, everytime i attacked with everybody before the race starts
the riders with 85 fighter stat got in total 12 flashing red bar
the riders with 50 fighter stat got in total 10 flashing red bar
even if high fighter got 2 more i dont think its enough, imo the chance its more likely to be the same
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