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2018 World Championships
trekbmc
Ollfardh wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
Why you hate Moscon?
Because he is bad boy?
One of most interesting cyclists on he’s generation. He can do anything. Sprint, climb, ride at stones, classics you name it.
I would sign him fast.


Cipollini was a bad boy, Moscon is a scumbag. Racism, punching other riders and deliberately causing crashes is criminal behaviour.


The collective cheer that went up when he got dropped was one of the highlights of the season imo.



"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
 
Kalach
Valverde at 38 years old. Wow...much deserved. I just hope that he will be competitive in this dress in next season
Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.
_____________________________________________
PCM Velogames Championship - Top Results

* 1st Tour de Romandie ('19, '18)
* 1st Tour de Pologne ('20, '19)
* 2nd Tour of California ('19)
* 2nd Tour de Suisse ('18)
* 3rd Autumn Classics ('19, '18)
* 9th Spring Classics ('18)
 
Champ_Armstrong
He deserved it more than anyone!
Pain is temporary. Quitting lasts forever.
 
Avin Wargunnson
Finally he got that WC title, very well deserved, after being both smart and super strong, no chance for others in the group from moment he hanged there at the Holl (what a climb!!!).

Now at least one more season, maybe farewell one with rainbow jersey.

Now tell me that EPO benefits are not long lasting Pfft

Also Tommy D the rider of the year for me, both for spirit and results. Two GT podiums, medal from ITT WC and almost another one from the road race. Hats off
I'll be back
 
Champ_Armstrong
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Finally he got that WC title, very well deserved, after being both smart and super strong, no chance for others in the group from moment he hanged there at the Holl (what a climb!!!).

Now at least one more season, maybe farewell one with rainbow jersey.

Now tell me that EPO benefits are not long lasting Pfft

Also Tommy D the rider of the year for me, both for spirit and results. Two GT podiums, medal from ITT WC and almost another one from the road race. Hats off


So you're saying rider of the year is the rider who lost most? Pfft
Pain is temporary. Quitting lasts forever.
 
df_Trek
Guido Mukk wrote:
Why you hate Moscon?
Because he is bad boy?
One of most interesting cyclists on he’s generation. He can do anything. Sprint, climb, ride at stones, classics you name it.
I would sign him fast.


Absolutely +1 , he is one of my favourite riders
 
Champ_Armstrong
df_Trek wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
Why you hate Moscon?
Because he is bad boy?
One of most interesting cyclists on he’s generation. He can do anything. Sprint, climb, ride at stones, classics you name it.
I would sign him fast.


Absolutely +1 , he is one of my favourite riders


He'll be good until Evenepoel makes the entrance. Arrivederci
Pain is temporary. Quitting lasts forever.
 
Avin Wargunnson
Champ_Armstrong wrote:
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Finally he got that WC title, very well deserved, after being both smart and super strong, no chance for others in the group from moment he hanged there at the Holl (what a climb!!!).

Now at least one more season, maybe farewell one with rainbow jersey.

Now tell me that EPO benefits are not long lasting Pfft

Also Tommy D the rider of the year for me, both for spirit and results. Two GT podiums, medal from ITT WC and almost another one from the road race. Hats off


So you're saying rider of the year is the rider who lost most? Pfft

Well, i dont count Skybots as humans, so he was the best human in most cases Pfft
I'll be back
 
Guido Mukk
Ollfardh wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
Why you hate Moscon?
Because he is bad boy?
One of most interesting cyclists on he’s generation. He can do anything. Sprint, climb, ride at stones, classics you name it.
I would sign him fast.


Cipollini was a bad boy, Moscon is a scumbag. Racism, punching other riders and deliberately causing crashes is criminal behaviour.


Cippolini bad boy? He was damn gigolo.
Moscon is like rider from 60-90's. Not politically correct all the time. Hinault, Fignon, Anquentil, Roger De Vlaeminck..not much angels also. But let the legs talk.
You can not imagine ..how much punching-pushing happens at peloton behind TV cameras.
 
Gustavovskiy
You forgot Armstrong.
Manager of pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2020/Micros/duo.png Duolingo pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2020/Micros/duo.png
 
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df_Trek
Champ_Armstrong wrote:

He'll be good until Evenepoel makes the entrance. Arrivederci


He is good anyway, at least already demonstrate that have good results as pro
 
Ollfardh
Guido Mukk wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
Why you hate Moscon?
Because he is bad boy?
One of most interesting cyclists on he’s generation. He can do anything. Sprint, climb, ride at stones, classics you name it.
I would sign him fast.


Cipollini was a bad boy, Moscon is a scumbag. Racism, punching other riders and deliberately causing crashes is criminal behaviour.


Cippolini bad boy? He was damn gigolo.
Moscon is like rider from 60-90's. Not politically correct all the time. Hinault, Fignon, Anquentil, Roger De Vlaeminck..not much angels also. But let the legs talk.
You can not imagine ..how much punching-pushing happens at peloton behind TV cameras.


There's a big different between "not being politically correct all the time" and hurling racist abuse at someone. It's sad to see some people on this forum are minimizing this. You can like his cycling skills all you want, but do you really want to say you support this guy as a person?

You're right about the punching and pushing of course, but if you do in the biggest race of the year..

And the Reichenbach thing pretty much shows what kind of person he is. Instead of accepting his punishment with dignity, he attacks the person he deemed responsible for his suspension. This guy should be in jail, not in a PT team.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
 
df_Trek
Ollfardh wrote:

There's a big different between "not being politically correct all the time" and hurling racist abuse at someone. It's sad to see some people on this forum are minimizing this. You can like his cycling skills all you want, but do you really want to say you support this guy as a person?

You're right about the punching and pushing of course, but if you do in the biggest race of the year..

And the Reichenbach thing pretty much shows what kind of person he is. Instead of accepting his punishment with dignity, he attacks the person he deemed responsible for his suspension. This guy should be in jail, not in a PT team.


What Reichenbach moved against Moscon were very serious accusations, that however weren't confirmed from any testimony, something that would have started a lynching against him in the pro Peloton.
About Reza episode he paid enough with a (right) suspension of six weeks, many more than others with similar accusations (look Albasini, or whatever happens in others sports), and constant pressure by media after that. Too often is under media attacks, and this condition people's opinion imo.
Btw I don't want to justify his behaviour, but just say that people don't forgive him anything, and I don't want to be part of it. He is not different from many other professional sportsmen that people idolize.
 
Ollfardh
df_Trek wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:

There's a big different between "not being politically correct all the time" and hurling racist abuse at someone. It's sad to see some people on this forum are minimizing this. You can like his cycling skills all you want, but do you really want to say you support this guy as a person?

You're right about the punching and pushing of course, but if you do in the biggest race of the year..

And the Reichenbach thing pretty much shows what kind of person he is. Instead of accepting his punishment with dignity, he attacks the person he deemed responsible for his suspension. This guy should be in jail, not in a PT team.


What Reichenbach moved against Moscon were very serious accusations, that however weren't confirmed from any testimony, something that would have started a lynching against him in the pro Peloton.
About Reza episode he paid enough with a (right) suspension of six weeks, many more than others with similar accusations (look Albasini, or whatever happens in others sports), and constant pressure by media after that. Too often is under media attacks, and this condition people's opinion imo.
Btw I don't want to justify his behaviour, but just say that people don't forgive him anything, and I don't want to be part of it. He is not different from many other professional sportsmen that people idolize.


You're looking at the Reichenbach thing the wrong way. The facts are:

1) Moscon made a very weird manoeuvre in front of Reichenbach, causing him to crash in a downhill section. Several other riders have confirmed this and testified.
2) Reichenbach had previously testified against Moscon in the Reza case.

So there's definitely a motive and a collision. Now for a conviction, you need to prove that Moscon's manoeuvre was intentional and not just a steering error during a race. That is near impossible to prove, so that means he should not be convicted.

Does that mean he didn't do it? Of course not! While I fully agree you can't convict him for it, I'm convinced he did it on purpose. And I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one.

For the moment, he's still a small cyclist in the eyes of the press, but when he will get his first big win (which I'm sure he will get soon), you're going to see these stories popping up again, the commentators will bring up the racism and violence, maybe even a few riders will call him out on Twitter.

I can forgive one mistake or even two, but the punching, the racism and the crash, that's 3 strikes in still a very short career.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
 
Champ_Armstrong
Personally I can't stand racism and intentional violence but what I like about sport is personality. Moscon is not a bad boy. Moscon is a douchebag. But Moscon is also a personality in the sport.

We remember personalities..
Pain is temporary. Quitting lasts forever.
 
df_Trek
Ollfardh wrote:

You're looking at the Reichenbach thing the wrong way. The facts are:

1) Moscon made a very weird manoeuvre in front of Reichenbach, causing him to crash in a downhill section. Several other riders have confirmed this and testified.
2) Reichenbach had previously testified against Moscon in the Reza case.

So there's definitely a motive and a collision. Now for a conviction, you need to prove that Moscon's manoeuvre was intentional and not just a steering error during a race. That is near impossible to prove, so that means he should not be convicted.

Does that mean he didn't do it? Of course not! While I fully agree you can't convict him for it, I'm convinced he did it on purpose. And I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one.


I know the story in your point number 2, but simply I don't believe that the crash was intentional.

Ollfardh wrote:

For the moment, he's still a small cyclist in the eyes of the press, but when he will get his first big win (which I'm sure he will get soon), you're going to see these stories popping up again, the commentators will bring up the racism and violence, maybe even a few riders will call him out on Twitter.

I can forgive one mistake or even two, but the punching, the racism and the crash, that's 3 strikes in still a very short career.


He is actually already plagued from media, like the article in Cyclingnews were recounts his WC race and his finish interview, there still a paragraph showing all his past mistakes and bans, why that! In his normal race, and also a good one, remembering all the time his past errors, this wasn't necessary, and heavly influence fans opinion.
I'm also quite sure that riding for Sky doesn't help him about fans sympathy.
 
Ollfardh
Definitely agree with you there, riding for Sky doesn't help him.

You gotta admit how they played it though, suspending him for a few weeks when he had no important races and sending him on "diversity course". Just credible enough for the UCI not to give him a 6 month ban. Same after the punching incident, 5 weeks suspension, but don't worry he'll be back just in time for the world championships.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
 
Champ_Armstrong
The sky has no limits
Fits good for the team
Pain is temporary. Quitting lasts forever.
 
ringo182
Champ_Armstrong wrote:
The sky has no limits
Fits good for the team


Would any team have realistically done any more/less than what Sky did? At the end of the day they were under no legal obligation to do anything. Have any other teams got instances where they have banned their own riders without any legal requirement to do so?
"Ringo is exactly right", Shonak - 8 September 2016
 
df_Trek
Ollfardh wrote:
Definitely agree with you there, riding for Sky doesn't help him.

You gotta admit how they played it though, suspending him for a few weeks when he had no important races and sending him on "diversity course". Just credible enough for the UCI not to give him a 6 month ban. Same after the punching incident, 5 weeks suspension, but don't worry he'll be back just in time for the world championships.


yes, that was for sure a sly move, but we are not new about this with Sky, btw it would have been a pity worlds without him, and the ban was actually from UCI (with same DQ of Grivko after punching Kittel)
 
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