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PCM.daily » Pro Cycling Manager 2013 » PCM 13: General
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Attributes Guide
Kaimelar
Flat: Effects the speed above -5% and under 5%, full effect is 0% towards the -5% and 5% effect decreases; no effect during TT; has decreased bonus on cobblestone stages depending on the length of cobble section, has decreased bonus depending on the difficulty of cobble section (on 5* section insignificant bonus)

Cobble: Effects the speed on cobblestone sections, also on flat parts depending on how much cobblestone is on the stage (for example: Paris-Roubaix, cobble stat weights more than flat stat on flat parts, meaning a 85CB,70FL is faster than 70CB, 85FL on non-cobbled flat sections)

Time-Trial/Prologue: Effects your speed during Time-Trials meaning you reach the finish with less energy used so you can use higher effort with higher TT/PRL stat, has no effect outside of Time-Trials; TT stat has no effect under 5km Time-Trials, PRL stat has no effect over 30km Time-trials; 17,5km long Time-Trial is the point when TT and PR are 50-50% used; Influence of TT decreases towards 5km from 30km, while PRL decreases towards 30km from 5km long Time-Trials; during Time-Trials when you run out of energy effort still makes difference meaning 99 effort is going to be faster than 60 effort

Downhill: Effects the speed under -2%

Endurance (Stamina): Effect after 165-170km, higher STA means higher speed

Acceleration: Effects how fast you can reach your top speed even if you attack, sprint or do free effort, it doesn't effect the red bar anymore; gel doesnt effect ACC anymore either; no effect for high grade slopes

Sprint: Effects the speed during the part of stage when you can use the 'Sprint' button, even if you're not sprinting; doesn't effect speed while attacking; it has no effect on mountain/hill(like hillunga, muy) finishes; stages have sprint/hill ratio

Mountain/Hill: Effects the speed over 2%, stages have moutain/hill ratio which decides how much impact each stat has

Fighter: Has no Effect for human players (in 3D mode)

Resistance: Has no effect in 3D mode for human players, have impact on simulation especially on mountain stages; used to effect yellow bar consumption in previous versions; Cyanide should fix it

Recuperation: Higher REC means more freshness regenerated after a stage. (worse freshness means less green, yellow, red bar at the start of the stage)

Energy comsuption:
-143 uses no green, yellow and red bar, regenerates yellow and red bar
144-166 uses green bar but no yellow and red bar, regenerates yellow and red bar (166 didn't regenerate any yellow even after 120km)
167-185 uses green and yellow bar but no red bar, regenerates only the red bar
186- uses green, yellow and red bar, doesn't regenerate any bar

Energy Gel: Uses less red bar while gel is active (when its orange colored) so should be used when u attk/sprint or use high effort, since it only uses less red your attack lasts longer but it makes you use up more yellow bar because the effort lasts longer, doesnt effect ACC

Green moment (flashing red bar while attacking): Uses less red and yellow bar during the attack, making it last longer; it's way more effective than energy gel, doesnt effect ACC

Energy gel + Green moment effect stacks making your attack last way longer than a normal attack would

Misc.:
Attack and free effort 99 are same in energy consumption, speed and length of the 'attack', Sprint are faster than 99 effort but uses more energy
Cyclist's weight and height has no effect


I'm still not done with all my testings(mostly sprint and sprint/hill ratio ones, thread will be updated later).
I ran the tests with cutom made databases, stages with no daily form effect etc...
Edited by Kaimelar on 27-07-2013 15:29
 
Lachi
Wow. Great work you did.
Edited by Lachi on 08-07-2013 12:30
 
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admirschleck
This is awesome man. Will really help newbies to learn more about playing and game system. Great job!
Manager of www.dodaj.rs/f/41/er/4zELHZA1/nor.pngTeam Nordeus www.dodaj.rs/f/41/er/4zELHZA1/nor.png
 
Ian Butler
Some good work.

But are you sure REC and RES don't affect riders? Seems very unlikely..
 
TheManxMissile
Well i dispute both REC and RES having no impact in 3D mode during career. Though i do think both have been reduced this year.

also how did you do your testing?
i.imgur.com/UmX5YX1.jpgi.imgur.com/iRneKpI.jpgi.imgur.com/fljmGSP.jpgi.imgur.com/qV5ItIc.jpgimgur.com/dr2BAI6.jpgimgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpgi.imgur.com/C1rG9BW.jpgi.imgur.com/sEDS7gr.jpg
 
Kaimelar
Lachi wrote:
Wow. Great work you did.

But I am not sure if I understand the bonus of the flat stat. Is it like this: 50 FL = -5% speed / 85 FL = +5% speed.
I guess MO / HIL works the same as FL.


Thanks, it works same as mo/hi, didn't test exact speed difference but i can tell roughly how it was (flat was the first thing I tested 1 week ago so may not remember exactly~); on a normal 0% it was like 50 goes with 35km/h, 72 42km/h, 85 50km/h on same effort (not exact numbers but i can check it for you if you want), on 4,9% it was 85 flat gained 13-5 seconds on 50 flat in 30km long 4,9% part


Ian Butler wrote:
Some good work.

But are you sure REC and RES don't affect riders? Seems very unlikely..


That's what i said too, i can't believe it, so i'm hoping others can test it too, even though i tried nearly everything
Edited by Kaimelar on 08-07-2013 11:58
 
Jesleyh
Nice work indeed.

I agree with the REC/RES criticism above here though Wink

And Stamina won't affect any speed in terms of riding I think, rather the speed that the green bar drops. And when the green bar drops, you'll get a higher heart rate easier, I think.
i1326.photobucket.com/albums/u660/jesleyh/Junk/0ca5fb14-ed59-44b1-8eb0-596097ba5c01_zps8e97f370.jpg

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PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
 
Kaimelar
Jesleyh wrote:
And Stamina won't affect any speed in terms of riding I think, rather the speed that the green bar drops. And when the green bar drops, you'll get a higher heart rate easier, I think.


It effected speed in my tests, even though green bar stayed same for the cyclists
 
Kaimelar
TheManxMissile wrote:
Well i dispute both REC and RES having no impact in 3D mode during career. Though i do think both have been reduced this year.

also how did you do your testing?



You mean overall or for RES/REC for example?
Anyway for RES first i tested the yellow bar, had database with my team only same stats for those who i tested only RES amount changed like 85 80 60 50, then did the 'easy' test line up 2 guy and do same effort (both has same heart rate this way), tried with 77 effort so it uses yellow, both rider had same speed and lost the yellow in same time, next time tried with Attacking same again, then tried to test them not being next to each other so they had like 30 second difference I did same things what i did preciously same result; energy regeneration was same too, (of course had daily form etc disabled too and ran the tests several times for same things; even cyclist's age was sameGrin)
Tried other theories too, like they can stay with the group for more time etc. but find no difference
I do hope I made a mistake though
Edited by Kaimelar on 08-07-2013 12:20
 
mpritch
Great stuff!!

The time you spent on this is appreciated by many!!!
 
DubbelDekker
Great job!

Very surprised by the RES thing. Maybe we should ask Cyanide about it?
i.imgur.com/5iNQj.png
 
tellico
Can you test how much length of green bar affects speed?
Rider A has a green bar full in 75%, rider B has green bar full in 50%.
What effort (or pulse) rider B needs to ride with the same speed as rider A which has, for example, 143 pulse.
Or can you say what difference in pulse is for one point FL or HILL diff? Rider A has 75FL and goes with 143 pulse, what pulse will have a rider B which has 70FL? We leave wind or peloton influence of course.
I think this is very interesting and no one has tested.
Edited by tellico on 08-07-2013 13:25
 
ShortsNL
Kaimelar wrote:
Endurance (Stamina): Effect after 165-170km, higher STA means higher speed


Are you sure about this? On the forum people always believed that the STA bonus would only kick in after exactly 200km, not sooner.
 
Pellizotti2
ShortsNL wrote:
Kaimelar wrote:
Endurance (Stamina): Effect after 165-170km, higher STA means higher speed

Are you sure about this? On the forum people always believed that the STA bonus would only kick in after exactly 200km, not sooner.

180km, actually
i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq112/Gustavovskiy/microjerseys14/kzi.png Manager of Kazzinc Procycling i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq112/Gustavovskiy/microjerseys14/kzi.png

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Kaimelar
ShortsNL wrote:
Are you sure about this? On the forum people always believed that the STA bonus would only kick in after exactly 200km, not sooner.



Well, it gives visible bonus after 165-170; did test fast for you, 3 screens, if you want i can upload the video but i don't think it's necessary:
i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a626/Kaimelar_hu/sta1_zpse83e2b5b.jpg
157km 23 second difference, it was 18-25 since the 10th km
i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a626/Kaimelar_hu/sta2_zpsa7999be8.jpg
169km 32 second difference
i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a626/Kaimelar_hu/sta3_zps2c2b5894.jpg
186km 1 minute difference, did that screen to show theres 1 km/h speed difference (bottom screen was made first)

Ran 2 test once with 85 guy front once with 50 guy front, it was a 192km stage; sorry that I didn't do proper test(custom map with no wind etc.) but wanted to do it fast for you


tellico wrote:
Can you test how much length of green bar affects speed?
Rider A has a green bar full in 75%, rider B has green bar full in 50%.
What effort (or pulse) rider B needs to ride with the same speed as rider A which has, for example, 143 pulse.
Or can you say what difference in pulse is for one point FL or HILL diff? Rider A has 75FL and goes with 143 pulse, what pulse will have a rider B which has 70FL? We leave wind or peloton influence of course.
I think this is very interesting and no one has tested.


May try to do that next week, but don't take my word on it.
Edited by Kaimelar on 08-07-2013 14:28
 
tellico
I just did a quick test and its look that length of green bar have no impact on speed. Tired cyclist with 50% of green bar, riding at the same speed on the same effort and pulse as a 100% green fresh one.
I cant believe it...
Edited by tellico on 08-07-2013 14:48
 
Kaimelar
tellico wrote:
I just did a quick test and its look that length of green bar have no impact on speed. Tired cyclist with 50% of green bar, riding at the same speed on the same effort and pulse as a 100% green fresh one.
I cant believe it...


I tested it quickly, but there is difference not that much what I thought would be but there is some ( 20%~ green bar guy vs 50%~ green bar, 50% won by like only 1 minute~ on 10km~ mountain)
Maybe that's why breakaways can stay away this year, because of the less impact?
 
cio93
Kaimelar wrote:
Maybe that's why breakaways can stay away this year, because of the less impact?


Yeah. If 6 riders, after being on the front all day, can relay at effort 85 just as long and fast as the 6 riders relaying in the peloton, that's an obvious consequence.

Never in a lifetime should the early morning break at MSR be able to ride faster on the flat between the poggio's than the bunch as it just happened to me.
 
Lachi
I wonder if the Cyanide programmers really know what the stats do. I guess they don't.
 
tellico
Ok, I did test again. Maybe first time distance was too short. On the last 35km of L-B-L:
1. half green bar vs full green bar on effort 70 both: 57 sec gap on the finish
2. half bar vs full bar on effort 59: 51 sec gap
3. both full green bar, but first +4 day form, second -5 day form: ~50 sec gap.
Thanks God its working, but i think in PCM12 gaps are bigger, not sure.
 
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